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Game Journal: "Cybil"

#181 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 13 October 2024 - 01:46 PM

ALL story and bosses and... everything really, is done!

ONLY bug testing/assigning music to boards remains!

I'm really, really happy with how the last story screen I made turned out, so it was the right call to nuke the previous version.

Also changed the behaviour of several magical weapons, since I've long had doubts about how interesting some of them were, while another couple
were honestly kind of broken (as in overpowered). The balance and the effects of these weapons feels way better now.

Link to Google Photos album with pictures from the current version of the game:
https://photos.app.g...6oV511dAMCQMXFA

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 13 October 2024 - 11:50 PM

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#182 User is offline   NoahSoft 

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Posted 13 October 2024 - 05:02 PM

HOLY SHIT ITS ALMOST DONE!!

:frostyangel:
<=D I AM A ROCKER. I ROCK OUT.<=D
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#183 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 02:14 AM

Yup, it really is. Almost done implementing music. It got so confusing that I think I want to make a spreadsheet to count how many times each track has been used and which tracks are tied to
specific areas.
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#184 User is offline   Feoramund 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 03:37 AM

View PostMicMotorhead, on 13 October 2024 - 10:14 PM, said:

Yup, it really is. Almost done implementing music. It got so confusing that I think I want to make a spreadsheet to count how many times each track has been used and which tracks are tied to
specific areas.


That's a fine idea. Depending on which area uses what song, you could mix it up too, so it's not all one song for an extended time then a bunch of random songs.
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#185 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 10:45 AM

View PostFeoramund, on 14 October 2024 - 04:37 AM, said:

That's a fine idea. Depending on which area uses what song, you could mix it up too, so it's not all one song for an extended time then a bunch of random songs.


Exactly. Each distinct area has its own music, while dungeons should rotate a selection of generic dungeon tracks. But there's a lot of types of screens and I sort
of lost track of what was used where and if I was cycling dungeon tracks properly. Making a spreadsheet today, maybe even adding a few new tracks if I need more.
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#186 User is offline   NoahSoft 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 04:10 PM

I'm hyped. I might zeux it up today cuz you're inspiring me. Are you on the Discord?

:frostyangel:
<=D I AM A ROCKER. I ROCK OUT.<=D
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#187 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 06:29 PM

Go for it - maybe we'll se two games release in the same week? :shades:
Although I find that finishing up all the small things usually turns out to be a pretty big thing :laughing:

I've visited the Discord once, I think. Can't even remember my login!

Update on the game:
- Soundtrack implemented
- Done testing!
- Just finished remixing a track that had too much bass when using quality headphones.
- Currently reading up on what you have to do to upload correctly.

I'm almost afraid to boot the game up again. I'll probably notice something that is WRONG. Ugh.
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#188 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 14 October 2024 - 06:44 PM

Game currently pending approval.
Wondering how to add my 125mb ZIP file containing all of the OGGs???
Maybe it will be obvious once approved.

Edit: Figured it out. Small green "+" symbol and I really need glasses.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 14 October 2024 - 06:48 PM

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#189 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 16 October 2024 - 02:27 PM

I was wondering if the game was pending, denied or if something had gone wrong while adding it, since I couldn't find any indication that I'd even tried to add it.

Today I spotted a little button on the front page and the game is listed under "my games". Since it doesn't show any music ZIP file, I'm gonna have to check
if I need to try and add that again once it goes live. I'm assuming that you'd get some sort of notice if there was a problem with your upload and it got denied.

I also just noticed that you can set up the web player for your game. I'm curious if it would work 100% with my game - music included, since it's a sperarate zip
- and if you can actually save while using the web player.

One thing I know I kind of messed up is that inside the main game ZIP file, there's a folder named "game files". I obviously should have titled that folder after
the game like literally every single other upload to the site derp.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 16 October 2024 - 02:29 PM

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#190 User is offline   NoahSoft 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 07:38 PM

CONGRATUFUCKINLATIONS BUD!!!! THIS IS HUGE!! playin rn

:frostyangel:
<=D I AM A ROCKER. I ROCK OUT.<=D
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#191 User is offline   Lachesis 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 08:49 PM

Congrats on finishing your game!

I took a look at the upload and you're right, renaming the folder in that zip to something like "Cybil" and re-adding it to the record might be a good idea (I can change it to the primary archive).

Re: the music zip, there's a 100MiB upload limit and you probably ran into that. I will bump it up a little and you should be able to add it without any problem.

Also, a side note: for future bugfixes/versions you're going to want to upload a separate game record (rather than adding new zips to this one). Someone can then combine the two records into one page that lets you view either version.

edit: okay, the limit should be increased now.

View PostMicMotorhead, on 14 October 2024 - 12:44 PM, said:

Edit: Figured it out. Small green "+" symbol and I really need glasses.

No, it's not your fault, the archive interface is just badly designed.

This post has been edited by Lachesis: 18 October 2024 - 08:58 PM

"Let's just say I'm a GOOD hacker, AND virus maker. I'm sure you wouldn't like to pay for another PC would you?"

xx̊y (OST) - HELLQUEST (OST) - Zeux I: Labyrinth of Zeux (OST) (DOS OST)
w/ Lancer-X and/or asgromo: Pandora's Gate - Thanatos Insignia - no True(n) - For Elise OST
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#192 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 09:40 PM

View PostLachesis, on 18 October 2024 - 09:49 PM, said:

Congrats on finishing your game!

I took a look at the upload and you're right, renaming the folder in that zip to something like "Cybil" and re-adding it to the record might be a good idea (I can change it to the primary archive).

Re: the music zip, there's a 100MiB upload limit and you probably ran into that. I will bump it up a little and you should be able to add it without any problem.

Also, a side note: for future bugfixes/versions you're going to want to upload a separate game record (rather than adding new zips to this one). Someone can then combine the two records into one page that lets you view either version.

edit: okay, the limit should be increased now.


Thanks for responding and helping to get this stuff sorted.

I renamed the folder and re-zipped. Even took the opportunity to change a small detail in the mzx file before wrapping it up again. It's been added to the original entry like you suggested.

The ZIP with the OGG music files has also been re-added. I still can't see it on the game page, so I think it might be way too big. It's 125mb. I could maybe just add it as a part 1 and a part 2 instead. I think I'll do that, since I'm pretty sure it didn't go through this time either.

If I'm creating a mess on the game page, I apologize - but I'm just really not sure which things are successfully getting added and which are not.
Added two new ZIP files named "Cybil_OGG_1" and "Cybil_OGG_2", each containging one half of the soundtrack.

EDIT: I can see the music archives now. The 125mb one is not there, so it seems it was necessary to split it.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 18 October 2024 - 09:46 PM

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#193 User is offline   Lachesis 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 09:46 PM

View PostMicMotorhead, on 18 October 2024 - 03:40 PM, said:

Thanks for responding and helping to get this stuff sorted.

I renamed the folder and re-zipped. Even took the opportunity to change a small detail in the mzx file before wrapping it up again. It's been added to the original entry lige you suggested.
The ZIP with the OGG music files has also been re-added. I still can't see it on the game page, so I think it might be way too big. It's 125mb. I could maybe just add it as a part 1 and a part 2 instead. I think I'll do that, since I'm pretty sure it didn't go through this time either.

If I'm creating a mess on the game page, I apologize - but I'm just really not sure which things are successfully getting added and which are not.
Added two new ZIP files named "Cybil_OGG_1" and "Cybil_OGG_2", each containging one half of the soundtrack.

EDIT: I can see the music archives now. The 125mb one is not there, so it seems it was necessary to split it.

That's strange. There might be somewhere aside from PHP enforcing the 100MiB limit that I forgot about. Splitting it into two archives works too!
"Let's just say I'm a GOOD hacker, AND virus maker. I'm sure you wouldn't like to pay for another PC would you?"

xx̊y (OST) - HELLQUEST (OST) - Zeux I: Labyrinth of Zeux (OST) (DOS OST)
w/ Lancer-X and/or asgromo: Pandora's Gate - Thanatos Insignia - no True(n) - For Elise OST
MegaZeux: Online Help File - Keycode Guide - Joystick Guide - Official GIT Repository
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#194 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 09:55 PM

View PostLachesis, on 18 October 2024 - 10:46 PM, said:

That's strange. There might be somewhere aside from PHP enforcing the 100MiB limit that I forgot about. Splitting it into two archives works too!


Thanks for the attempt anyways :)

And by the way, it's awesome that MegaZeux supports .RAD files now. I read it in a changelog of the newest version and was surprised.
I'm definitely making use of that in a future project!
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#195 User is offline   Lachesis 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 10:05 PM

Okay, I had to troubleshoot why the music wasn't working for a little bit (HTML5 port configuration jank, it turns out), but it's working now and I went ahead and approved it. Please verify that everything looks correct, and also consider making a New Game Releases post :)

View PostMicMotorhead, on 18 October 2024 - 03:55 PM, said:

Thanks for the attempt anyways :)

And by the way, it's awesome that MegaZeux supports .RAD files now. I read it in a changelog of the newest version and was surprised.
I'm definitely making use of that in a future project!

Yes! I saw interest in using it from you and a couple other users and since the RADv2 replayer is written in C++, I went ahead and added support for it. I would caution you away from nesting riffs for the time being, but just about everything else should work fine for both v1 and v2 RADs.
"Let's just say I'm a GOOD hacker, AND virus maker. I'm sure you wouldn't like to pay for another PC would you?"

xx̊y (OST) - HELLQUEST (OST) - Zeux I: Labyrinth of Zeux (OST) (DOS OST)
w/ Lancer-X and/or asgromo: Pandora's Gate - Thanatos Insignia - no True(n) - For Elise OST
MegaZeux: Online Help File - Keycode Guide - Joystick Guide - Official GIT Repository
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#196 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 18 October 2024 - 10:28 PM

View PostLachesis, on 18 October 2024 - 11:05 PM, said:

Okay, I had to troubleshoot why the music wasn't working for a little bit (HTML5 port configuration jank, it turns out), but it's working now and I went ahead and approved it. Please verify that everything looks correct, and also consider making a New Game Releases post :)


Yes! I saw interest in using it from you and a couple other users and since the RADv2 replayer is written in C++, I went ahead and added support for it. I would caution you away from nesting riffs for the time being, but just about everything else should work fine for both v1 and v2 RADs.


I'm gonna read up on that thing about nested riffs. Doesn't sound like anything I've ever done in Reality Adlib Tracker, but it's still interesting.
Cybil has 2 RAD tracks in the soundtrack, but they're included as OGG files. I recorded output directly from DosBox and normalized the volume with Audacity.

Thanks for the assistance. I downloaded the game myself and did a quick test. Everything seems to be working beautifully. Found a typo already! But what's a game release without need for patching lol

Gonna have to write down notes for all of the little things I will no doubt find so I can make a major patch somewhere down the line.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 18 October 2024 - 10:42 PM

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#197 User is offline   Maxim 

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Posted 19 October 2024 - 02:06 AM

I've been playing for about 30 minutes so far. I really like it so far. I just finished playing Might and Magic 3, and it looks like I may be getting into something similar here. Good job by you. I'm playing on hard mode so I don't finish it too fast.
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#198 User is offline   Lachesis 

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Posted 19 October 2024 - 05:34 AM

View PostMicMotorhead, on 18 October 2024 - 04:28 PM, said:

I'm gonna read up on that thing about nested riffs. Doesn't sound like anything I've ever done in Reality Adlib Tracker, but it's still interesting.


It is basically when you do the following:

F-4 1 T01


And riff page 0 looks something like this:

| 1         | 2         | ...
|-----------|-----------|-----
| C-4 1 R02 | ... . 3FF | ...
| ... . ... | ... . 300 | ...


A channel won't run two channel riffs at the same time. What happens in the tracker is that the first note of R01 is processed and the current riff for that channel immediately switches to R02 (including playing the first line of R02). However, due to a bug, the replayer currently keeps playing R01 instead. This is easily avoidable by not referencing any riffs inside of other riffs (either by Rxx/Txx or by using other instruments inside of an instrument riff). It will be fixed for both types of riffs next release.
"Let's just say I'm a GOOD hacker, AND virus maker. I'm sure you wouldn't like to pay for another PC would you?"

xx̊y (OST) - HELLQUEST (OST) - Zeux I: Labyrinth of Zeux (OST) (DOS OST)
w/ Lancer-X and/or asgromo: Pandora's Gate - Thanatos Insignia - no True(n) - For Elise OST
MegaZeux: Online Help File - Keycode Guide - Joystick Guide - Official GIT Repository
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#199 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 19 October 2024 - 05:25 PM

View PostMaxim, on 19 October 2024 - 03:06 AM, said:

I've been playing for about 30 minutes so far. I really like it so far. I just finished playing Might and Magic 3, and it looks like I may be getting into something similar here. Good job by you. I'm playing on hard mode so I don't finish it too fast.


Happy to hear it! As you make progress, please feel free to tell me what you think - INCLUDING the negatives :)

Fun fact: The game's shop system is inspired by Might & Magic 6. I felt like shops were more fun to visit in that game than in many RPGs, because there always seems to be something you don't see in other shops or at least a diverse selection of items. So I tried to make all shops in Cybil different from each other, instead of having them feel like they're copy-pasted. Another old RPG with really fun shops to visit is Dungeon Master 2. I've played the first half of that game countless times because I love the vibe of the outdoors areas.

And yeah, I think the game is sort of dungeon-crawler flavored, but with a lot of overworld exploration which, now that I think of it that way, is a lot like the M&M games.

If you're playing on the very hardest difficulty, you should know that that difficulty level is entirely untested. It basically has the enemies scale just like on the second hardest difficulty level, but they gain initiative 50% faster (+15 points per inactive turn instead of +10). I'm sure it's possible to win, but it might require a lot of patience.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 19 October 2024 - 05:35 PM

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#200 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 19 October 2024 - 05:28 PM

View PostLachesis, on 19 October 2024 - 06:34 AM, said:

It is basically when you do the following:

F-4 1 T01


And riff page 0 looks something like this:

| 1         | 2         | ...
|-----------|-----------|-----
| C-4 1 R02 | ... . 3FF | ...
| ... . ... | ... . 300 | ...


A channel won't run two channel riffs at the same time. What happens in the tracker is that the first note of R01 is processed and the current riff for that channel immediately switches to R02 (including playing the first line of R02). However, due to a bug, the replayer currently keeps playing R01 instead. This is easily avoidable by not referencing any riffs inside of other riffs (either by Rxx/Txx or by using other instruments inside of an instrument riff). It will be fixed for both types of riffs next release.


That might straight up be a function I wasn't even aware of!
I write in a pretty simple manner: One channel is riffs, one is bass, one is cymbals, one is snares, etc. When I get more fancy, it will be stuff like having a lower volume mirror of the riff channel at
a higher octave or something like that. The effects I have used with the RAD format have probably mostly been note modulation and note-by-note volume changes.
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#201 User is offline   Maxim 

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Posted 19 October 2024 - 06:45 PM

Ha, I knew there was M&M influence. I bet Jon Van Caneghem would love this game.

I'm playing on the middle difficulty, right after "balanced". It's perfect so far. Hard enough that I lose very often, but I was still able to clear 2 dungeons in the 2-3 hours or so I spent on it last night. I even like the random weapon breaking.

Negatives? Minor so far. I was able to move the player into the status area on the telescope board. I'll keep an eye out for anything else.
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#202 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 20 October 2024 - 09:56 PM

View PostMaxim, on 19 October 2024 - 07:45 PM, said:

Ha, I knew there was M&M influence. I bet Jon Van Caneghem would love this game.

I'm playing on the middle difficulty, right after "balanced". It's perfect so far. Hard enough that I lose very often, but I was still able to clear 2 dungeons in the 2-3 hours or so I spent on it last night. I even like the random weapon breaking.

Negatives? Minor so far. I was able to move the player into the status area on the telescope board. I'll keep an eye out for anything else.


Glad to see you making some real progress!
The random weapon breaking is there to force the player to use the full arsenal of resources. In theory, even the worst weapons might have some relevance late in the game, especially considering some later skills and items interact with weapons in varying ways.

Adding the telescope board mistake to my bugs/issues list.
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#203 User is offline   Maxim 

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Posted 21 October 2024 - 07:59 AM

Just something to consider for the update: would you have room to add a representation of the equipped weapon to the Cybil paper doll on the left side of the screen? It might not be possible to get the proportions right, but it would be pretty cool if it worked.
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#204 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 21 October 2024 - 11:30 AM

View PostMaxim, on 21 October 2024 - 08:59 AM, said:

Just something to consider for the update: would you have room to add a representation of the equipped weapon to the Cybil paper doll on the left side of the screen? It might not be possible to get the proportions right, but it would be pretty cool if it worked.


That is definitely something that would be nice, but it's gonna be pretty hard to do, since every weapon would have to have variants accounting for every possible costume that could be behind. One thing I did consider at some point was having it so that a picture of each inventory item could be viewed from inside the inventory, basically teleporting you to a "view item" board and copying the relevant MZM to the board. But it would be a lot of work, just to have it only be viewable fom the inventory.
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#205 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 21 October 2024 - 11:56 AM

But I do accept suggestions for additions/changes beyond bug fixing. Of course no promises that I'll agree with them :laughing:

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 21 October 2024 - 11:57 AM

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#206 User is offline   Maxim 

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Posted 23 October 2024 - 03:29 AM

Honestly, I can't think of a proper way to make it work either. Not without a bunch of manual work. And getting the foreshortening and perspective even close to right with text blocks would be a horrible ordeal. I don't have any other specific suggestions, other than that one I didn't think through very well. I just really like the idea of leaning into the similarity to the Might and Magic games.
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#207 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 23 October 2024 - 06:03 AM

I do like that old school DOS RPG thing where you have a character model showing all of your equipment. But the game would really have to be built with that in mind from the get go. It would be fun to do in another game project: Upper body, lower body, arms, head all separated with their own MZM blocks so that you could show varying armor pieces combined. A character pose where the weapons/shields held don't overlap with the body would also make things way easier to handle.

I have some regrets about how I chose to make the game, since some things that I would like to do just wouldn't gel with what else is going on. I chose to lean into the whole 1 player character vs 1 enemy turn based thing with minimal stats and equipment types early on and just had to stick with it later on.

This post has been edited by MicMotorhead: 23 October 2024 - 06:04 AM

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#208 User is offline   Maxim 

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Posted 23 October 2024 - 10:03 AM

The simplicity of the systems isn't necessarily a bad thing. You can make the next one more complex if you decide to continue making RPGs. There's more than enough going on here to keep the game interesting.
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#209 User is offline   MicMotorhead 

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Posted 25 October 2024 - 06:01 AM

Going to take a closer took at the game's potentially biggest bug: Riddle gates (and maybe other types of gates?) locking forever if you try to open them by bumping into them. That would be pretty bad and I definitely have to fix all of the instances of this problem. Thanks to Maxim for finding one.
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